. >> yes, very big debate. >> rose: and tt debate is? >> tha debate is, ones that whether you can go create an islamic state through the current political democratic way, or that democracy is the enemy of islam, it's not an islamic way so you have to topple it through, you know, an undemocratic way. i think there is a dete on that. and then the second underlying debate is if we are in power, should we still be democracy. so more directly into what they callslamic wing. >> rose: and what wod be the role model for that? >> well, this is the problem. because they don't have what we call the practical example in reality. t they wou have like the way when prophet mohammed rule or -- 1400 years ago. >> re: do most people in indonesia consid iran a success? >> only minorities. turkey is much more a mod. >> rose: and turkey is what indonesia would le to be? >> some indonesia is, the justice party look at turkey as a model. but some of the people saying that turkey is not a finished model. it's going to the right model. >> rose: there are people